oil

[JagoGell]

If your van has had cheap oil or no oil changes in its long life before you, then it makes no difference if you use the best or the cheapest oil.

The damage/wear has already occurred - no amount of top quality oil can replace the wear.

I believe the vans that have been noted as having very little oil use have had good maintenance by its previous owners from new, the ones that burn a lot have not.

If you look at Supertech (Walmart brand) full synthetic 5w20 and Mobile 1 full synthetic 5w20, you can compare the ratings. What you will find is they both meet the same ratings.

Having said that, premium brands may include additives that the cheaper brand may not, that can enhance corrosion protection for example, or anti-foaming ingredients, or low temperature flow enhancers, etc. But, both will perform at or above most manufacturer's requirements.

Cheap oil changed regularly would be better than expensive oil changed infrequently.

I'm sure someone mentioned chief engineer of Nissan GTR project saying something along the same lines.

I agree with your point regarding the oil burners vs non oil burners , the damage for whatever reason is already done, but at least you can do some damage limitation by pursuing a regime of regular changes.

(Edit for typo)

 

[Elgraman]

Now we have entered the great oil debate

I Spent years riding bikes

Spent hours, normally over beer, discussing oil
For track days, normal rides and touring
And I don't think I am any the wiser

Jon

It continues as like tyre talk, oil talk is just plain sexy

 

[Jon M]

And get more sexy in proportion to the amount of alcohol consumed

Jon

 

[bikerToe]

It continues as like tyre talk, oil talk is just plain sexy

do you use it all over your body or just to lube you shaft ?

 

[Jon M]

do you use it all over your body or just to lube you shaft ?

That made me laugh
Helps the piston move nicely

 

[Elgraman]

do you use it all over your body or just to lube you shaft ?

both

 

[RuskinStreet]

both

Oh dear

 

[Elgraman]

Here's a tidbit which may be boring, but is strange, nevertheless.
In the English E51 manual which is downloadable (on here somewhere), it says the E51 needs 5w-30 fully synthetic, to SN spec. (above SN fine too of course)
However, in the English hard copy E51 manual which I got off eBay, it says SL spec.
Might seem (and be) irrelevant, but SN is backwards compatible to 'L', but SL isn't (L lower in the alphabet than N).
Odd that what are essentially the same manuals say slightly different specs.

At the next service I was going to get Nissan's 5w-30 fully synthetic a5/b5 SL, which I've had in my juke Nismo since new. However, when I saw SN in the downloadable manual, I thought I won't. Now I see in my hard copy manual that SL is recommended. Overthinking I know, but odd nevertheless.


Believe it or not, this is the only oil I've found which is straight 5w-30 fully, a5/b5 SN, without millions of other C2/3/4s and other backwards compatible gizmo terminology

reCAPTCHA Verification

 

[MarkT]

In the English E51 manual which is downloadable (on here somewhere), it says the E51 needs 5w-30 fully synthetic, to SN spec [...]
However, in the English hard copy E51 manual which I got off eBay, it says SL spec.

It's going to depend on when the manual was written/updated.

API SJ was current until 2001, when SL was introduced. SM arrived in 2004 and SN in 2010/2011. SP is the latest specification. The recommendations for the E51s would have started as SJ.

API SL is still a current specification (ie API still licenses the term, they don't for SJ, which is why we don't find that on the shelves).

SL is fine in our engines, but SM is significantly better. For this reason, I recommend SM or better oils when newbies ask, even though I currently use SL.

I currently use SL because I got a load cheap and I do more frequent oil changes than most (the 20l for £70-odd from Costco is hard to beat...). Others here that recommend SL also change it more frequently. The theory is that cheaper oil changed more often is better than expensive oil changed less often. The reality is a little less clear cut - eg SM retains low temperature performance for longer and we'd all drop SL if it wasn't so bloody cheap ... SM changed as frequently as SL would absolutely be better, but way more expensive and we'd have less to spend on beer and cheese (and petrol).

Ultimately, as long as the oil is changed frequently, the engine will be fine. Better oils will mean it'll be even finer but we're all on a budget (apart from LeStempy, who resides in his French chateau living a life of such decadent luxury that would make even Louis XVI look like a pauper, and Lpgc in his (3 still?) Elgrands, who zooms everywhere at a cruising speed of "still accelerating").

 

[Elgraman]

But what about the likes of Mobil1 though, say ESP 5w-30 fully synthetic. It looks a great oil and very well priced, and meets SL,SM,SN,SN+......but what about the 'diesel' comparability it also got, with the C2,3,4 etc compatibility too?
MIne is a petrol, and is it a good idea to put in an oil that yes, meets the SL-> SN+...but also meets the compatibility of the Cs, typically found with diesels, and which might have additives which diesel engines like, but maybe not so much petrols?

That's what I'm thinking of a straight A5/B5 SL or SN, without the multitude of mass compatibility to other things?

This is what I'm probably going to go for.....but can you/people confirm it *IS* fully synthetic? I ask a stupid question as my suspicious mind says even though the ad etc says fully sythetic, it don't say anything on the container itself (and I've zoomed in on other sites too).

Castrol MAGNATEC 5W-30 A5 Fully Synthetic Car Engine Oil

The UK's largest independent supplier of automotive oils, fluid and parts. We've products to suit any vehicle, from full blown Race / Track weapons, to Daily Drivers looking to save money. Plus FREE expert advice & recommendations - OPIE KNOW OILS

www.opieoils.co.uk

Even on Castrol's website it don't say fully synthetic. I'm not saying it isn't, but where DOES it say it is?

https://www.castrol.com/en_gb/united-kingdom/home/car-engine-oil-and-fluids/engine-oils/engine-oil-brands/castrol-edge-brand/castrol-edge.html#tab_5w-30-a5-b5

 

[MarkT]

That's what I'm thinking of a straight A5/B5 SL or SN

I'm going to disappoint you... that Petronas Syntium 3000 FR 5W-30 is also API CF ... it's for diesel's too

You're totally over-thinking this. Here's what Takumi Kurosawa, former head of Nissan GT-R engine production, stated.

Change the oil every 3000 miles if you're wanting to keep the car for 250,000+ miles (change less often if you're not fussed about keeping it quite as long as that).

While he recommended Castro oils, he stressed that changing more often was more important than the brand of oil.

Filter-wise, he was happy for people to use cheap filters and recommended a new filter every second oil change (so every 6000 miles).

Regarding oil types, he recommended using a thinner winter (W) oil during colder months e.g. for the E51 that'd be 5W30 when it's warm, 0W30 in winter.

This was in a YouTube video somewhere. Interesting to get his take, given that he knows engines inside out and gets to see all the tests and wear etc.

 

[Elgraman]

Yes, I know I'm over thinking it and I know it kind of don't matter as long as the oil is changed regularly, but cost isn't an option (well, withing reason) and I don't mind treating my cars to the best I can get, even if the oil's changed regular.

 

[MarkT]

Yes, I know I'm over thinking it and I know it kind of don't matter as long as the oil is changed regularly, but cost isn't an option (well, withing reason) and I don't mind treating my cars to the best I can get, even if the oil's changed regular.

I understand now. Go for a quality API SP - that's the latest standard and is an improvement over the earlier SN, SM etc.

The API standards don't regress in any areas, so there are no applications/engines where you'd benefit from going to an earlier standard (other than cost).

 

[Jon M]

My goodness

What a massive amount of information - it's impressive.
Thank you to you all

I plan to get a service soon before I start some longer trips

I can now ask for the best oil with some knowledge

And having read other posts on changing auto gearbox oil as well
Jon

 

[JagoGell]

I'm going to disappoint you... that Petronas Syntium 3000 FR 5W-30 is also API CF ... it's for diesel's too

You're totally over-thinking this. Here's what Takumi Kurosawa, former head of Nissan GT-R engine production, stated.

Change the oil every 3000 miles if you're wanting to keep the car for 250,000+ miles (change less often if you're not fussed about keeping it quite as long as that).

While he recommended Castro oils, he stressed that changing more often was more important than the brand of oil.

Filter-wise, he was happy for people to use cheap filters and recommended a new filter every second oil change (so every 6000 miles).

Regarding oil types, he recommended using a thinner winter (W) oil during colder months e.g. for the E51 that'd be 5W30 when it's warm, 0W30 in winter.

This was in a YouTube video somewhere. Interesting to get his take, given that he knows engines inside out and gets to see all the tests and wear etc.

I very much agree.

In the E50 owners handbook it states:



"When shipped from the factory, gasoline vehicles are filled with 5W-30 (SJ class) engine oil, and diesel vehicles are filled with 10W-30 (CD class) engine oil."

CD - Introduced in 1955 for severe duty diesel engines, including turbo and Caterpillar Series 3, built before 1995. Equivalent to MIL-L-2104C. Now obsolete.

Anything developed after this surpasses the standard used out of the factory.

 

[Jon M]

Is there a PHD on engine oil and Elgrands

If not, perhaps there should be

 

[Griffy]

Hope your don't mind me jumping on this thread but in simple terms it doesn't matter what brand of oil to use for the e51 V6 petrol then? I will be changing my oil soon and the guy I bought the van off said use Morris oils?

 

[Tim C]

Hope your don't mind me jumping on this thread but in simple terms it doesn't matter what brand of oil to use for the e51 V6 petrol then? I will be changing my oil soon and the guy I bought the van off said use Morris oils?

You get what you pay for, the stuff in the middle aisle of aldi probably doesn't give as much protection as branded fully synthetic....

 

[Cato Fong]

In another thread I may have recommended Mannol oil - large German brand sold on ebay, etc, at very good prices, but have subsequently read that they are being investigated for price dumping after complaints from UK blenders- apparently using base stock oil which may be sanction busting/laundered.

 

[MarkT]

in simple terms it doesn't matter what brand of oil to use for the e51 V6 petrol then?

Pretty much.

If you want to do the best you can for the car, *more frequent oil changes is the important thing*. Quality oil that's been there a while is worse than cheap oil changed often. Source: some head engineer bod from Nissan, via a YouTube chat.